“I did denounce Mark Foley. We threw him out of our party”

Sorry, but reality doesn’t agree with you. I don’t really need to post the video of his speech again, do I?

“and nevermind the fact that the Fair Housing Act had been passed long before Bush came around AND homes had already been acquired before he took office, well then you have yourself a convenient set up for the Democrats”

Right, you just proved my point. When home ownership went up under Clinton, we didn’t have this foreclosure problem. For that to be the case, people would have to faithfully pay their home mortgages, and then decide out of the blue, to welch on their debts, just to punish Bush. You’re like a crazy person that believes till the end that everyone’s out to get them, in spite of every shred of evidence proving them wrong. Lead on, crazy person…

“Bush gave us good stock years”

Yeah, because that’s all that matters. Nevermind the dismal record on job creation, the loss of health insurance due to high costs, and the fact that the average person’s savings dwindled to -0.5%. Yay, stocks, that’s a good indicator of the real economy. Stocks are doing great right now, so according to you, the economy is doing lovely, right?

“He was held accountable”

Right, which explains why he’s a free man right now…

“Saddam Hussein himself went to the UN and bluffed about WMD AFTER we were attacked.”

No, no he didn’t. He did bluff about having weapons – to his neighbors. This by no means absolved the US to find any weapons we suspected he may have had. We looked, we didn’t find any. The UN had inspectors in Iraq for three months before we began shocking and awing the Iraqi people. But you know all this, it’s a matter of very public record. Bush, in his ‘ultimatum’ speech, warned the inspectors to leave the country because bombing would commence, weapons or not.

“Sorry about that, but it was not unavoidable and I am still thankful that GWB showed that part of the world that for a short while, the US would not tolerate stupid threats for the purposes of gaining power.”

Awesome, we have it on record that you think that war was not unavoidable. There was no credible threat, and anyone with half a brain saw that. I talked till I was blue in the face to people who, for lack of a better phrase, turned into mindless zombies, and didn’t want to hear any morsels of truth. They just wanted their revenge, and Hussein was as good a target as any.

“While your liberals were enthusiastic about going to war over the human rights abuses, they should have been ecstatic over Saddam”

Perhaps they might have been had they not rolled into the country on lies.

“National Security and taking out dangerous lunatics like Saddam Hussein before they develop the capabilites [sic] to hurt us IS PRECISELY worth it since future generations will now be alive because of it.”

So, it’s okay to start a preemptive war? I’m pretty sure that is, by definition, terrorism. That notion goes against every founding principle and law that makes this country the bastion of freedom that it claims to be. Attacking another nation so as to avoid the possibility of being attacked ourselves is deplorable. Using that logic, I could go out and murder someone and claim that it was justifiable because they could possibly murder me. That’s insane and any rational person can see that.

“The most attacks on America’s interest happened DURING Clinton’s administration”

Or, if you can count, Reagan’s. Here’s a short list, since you love to blame the advent of terrorism on Clinton:

•1981 – May 16 – One dead in an explosion in the toilets at the Pan Am terminal at New York’s JFK airport. The bombing is claimed by the Puerto Rican Resistance Army

•1982 – August 11: A bomb explodes on Pan Am Flight 830, en route from Tokyo to Honolulu, killing one teenager and injuring 15 passengers.

•1983 – Bombing of US Embassy in Beirut, April 18, 1983. 63 people, including 17 Americans, are killed.

•1983 – Marine barracks bombing, Beirut, October 23, 1983. 305 people, including 241 US servicemen, are killed by 2 suicide bombers.

•1984 – Twenty-two people were killed (two of them American) and seventy were wounded when a van loaded with four hundred pounds of explosives exploded in front of the U.S. Embassy annex in Awkar, Lebanon. Islamic Jihad (code name of Hezbollah) claimed responsibility for the bombing in a call to the media.

•1985 – TWA Flight 847 hijacked, U.S. Navy diver is killed by Hezbollah.

•1985 – Achille Lauro hijacking, wheel-chair bound American killed by Palestinian terrorists.

•1986 – Four Americans were killed and five Americans were injured when a bomb exploded aboard TWA Flight 840 as it traveled from Rome to Athens. The aircraft was able to land safely at Athens International Airport.

•1986 – On April 6, a Berlin discotheque bombing killed a Turkish woman and 2 US servicemen and injured 230 people, including more than 50 American servicemen.

•1987 – A car bomb exploded outside the back gate of the U.S. Embassy in Rome and mortars were fired at the compound from across the street. One passerby was injured in the attacks.

•1988 – On April 14 at 8 p.m., a car bomb exploded in front of the USO Club in Naples, Italy. Five people died and fifteen were injured, including four U.S. servicemen who were injured and US Navy Petty Officer Angela Santos, 21, was killed. Junzo Okudaira, a Japanese Red Army (JRA) member, was indicted in the United States on April 9, 1993 for the Naples bombing. Okudaira is also a suspect in the June 1987 car bombing and mortar attack against the U.S. Embassy in Rome.

•1988 – Pan Am Flight 103, outbound from London for New York with 259 people aboard, was destroyed by a bomb on December 21, 1988 while over Lockerbie, Scotland. All aboard the aircraft were killed as were eleven persons on the ground.

“After 9/11, Bush was responsible for making it clear that those kinds of attacks were not going to be planned on his watch, as it was with Clinton.”

You mean Reagan.

“But Bush was heavily criticized when he nominated Harriet Miers to the Supreme Court and when he backed McCain on immigration. I was in that clan and you cannot ever deny that”

Sure I can. I never read any such comments. It’s a fine diversion now, but like I said, never have I known you to say anything like that until painted into a corner, now.

“Of course we had an exit strategy. We exit when its done right, as it was done right by the end of Bush’s second term”

Planned as such, so as to help in the 2004 election (he still had to steal it). Remember not changing horses mid stream? Or as one comedian put it, you don’t change horsemen in the middle of the apocalypse. But had Bush gone in with the proper amount of troops, as he was advised to do by Gen. Eric Shinseki, there would have been no need for a surge. All the surge was was Bush acting on military advice five years too late.

“Once Bush realized it after the surge, he started setting timelines for withdrawal. Not quite sure what you’re talking about”

See above comment.

“Moreover; George Stephanopoulos himself advised Clinton around that time in 1997 to assassinate Saddam as he was deemed a threat long before.”

No you didn’t. You protected him for nearly five years, and when the facts finally did come out, he was whisked off to rehab before anyone could ask a single question.

“we merely pointed out that you liberals kept Gerry Studds around after he had ACTUAL SEXUAL INTERCOURSE with a 17-year old page”

Liberals did? More like his own constituents, who reelected him six more times after his censure by the house. And unlike Studds, pages came forward and complained of Foley’s inappropriate advances toward them. And while Studd’s relationship was consensual, it was with a 17 year old, which is disgusting, regardless of the age of consent in DC.

“You are more interested in rewarding enemies to demonize Ronald Reagan. You want hard workers to pay more taxes so you can reward those less deserving because you think they’ve been dealt some unsuspecting hand at life.”

I’m just going to agree with all the idiotic and baseless things that fly from your fingertips. It’s just easier this way…

“Attempting to befriend the new Iranian government causing our embassies to be invaded while allowing the Shah into our country for cancer treatment (and to have the knife removed from his back) at the Mayo Clinic.”

And how is that rewarding failure?

“Yet, you still find time to respond.”

Sharp as a tack, this one…

“And ONCE AGAIN, I don’t care to have water dripped down my nose, I didn’t kill anybody! Learn to separate.”

Perhaps you should learn the word proof. You can’t just torture people you suspect of wrongdoing. Normally, guilt must be proven before punishment can be administered. But then again, I’m talking to a conservative here.

“you insult the members of the military by insinuating that what they do is easy enough for anyone to do. So stop using it as an argument. It’s stupid and it insults the people responsible for keeping you safe.”

I’m insinuating? Last time I checked, it was a republican administration that upped the age of recruitment to 44. It was the same administration that allowed in people with criminal records. It’s not an insult, because I never said it, you did.

“Funnily enough, you first stated about Obama being born in Kenya before moving onto the real concerns like Wright and Ayers.”

None of those subjects are of concern to sane people, yet somehow, your side deferred to Wright and Ayers, because, according to the GOP candidate’s campaign manager, “if we continue to talk about the economy, we’ll lose”

Actually, let’s wait and see how many more industries he tries to get his hands on in the next 3.5 years before I go on record with that.

Thanks.

Seeings as members of my party were warning Democrats as little as three years ago, as McCain warned, as Bush warned – and nevermind the fact that the Fair Housing Act had been passed long before Bush came around AND homes had already been acquired before he took office, well then you have yourself a convenient set up for the Democrats. It blew up during the END of his administration as economists (or as you would peg them, racist elites known as Republicans) predicted it would.

“Really, because if they truly are the accountability ducking leeches you claim they are, then I’d be shocked to find out they weren’t big dubya supporters…”

I’m not sure how that washes? Bush gave us good stock years, he gave us eight safe years, the largest span of attacks on our interests by Muslims since it all began in 1979 happened under GWB. He was held accountable and he came through for us all but for Harriet Miers, the bailout, and his stance on immigration.

“History also tells us that with the exception of the Vietnam War, war is a legitimate and unavoidable thing.”

First: the US never lost a single battle in Vietnam – even when it was executed under the Democratic administrations. We didn’t back up our allies and yes, to the liberals happy minds, those folks are still living under communism. Second, Saddam Hussein himself went to the UN and bluffed about WMD AFTER we were attacked. He could have surrendered peacefully, but he did not. Sorry about that, but it was not unavoidable and I am still thankful that GWB showed that part of the world that for a short while, the US would not tolerate stupid threats for the purposes of gaining power.

Moreover; “Ma’am” Boxer herself said to Condoleezza Rice that she never wanted Saddam to see the light of day again, she just wished we could have peacefully nabbed him like we did with Milosevic. While your liberals were enthusiastic about going to war over the human rights abuses, they should have been ecstatic over Saddam….as Boxer pretended to be for a while anyway. But of course, Milosevic was the danger to the US, right? He made phony bluffs to the UN about WMD too, right?

“And I see you have no problem footing future generations with the bill for his little “democratic” endeavor to the tune of almost two trillion dollars.”

Absolutely justifiable. National Security and taking out dangerous lunatics like Saddam Hussein before they develop the capabilites to hurt us IS PRECISELY worth it since future generations will now be alive because of it. That is what Treasury money should be spent on. Not giving you an annual check to buy a flat screen TV.

“Before the bailout, he was God to you, Reagan incarnate. You like to pretend that isn’t the case because you’ve finally opened your eyes to the mess he left us with, and have no choice but to lay some criticism on him.”

He has my respect for keeping us safe even after we had to sit back and let Osama go and allow his posse to plot eight years while Clinton was pulling on his johnson for Monica. The most attacks on America’s interest happened DURING Clinton’s administration. Why shouldn’t they have planned 9/11? Between letting Osama go and focusing more on Monica, Clinton did everything but hang a welcome sign on our country’s borders.

After 9/11, Bush was responsible for making it clear that those kinds of attacks were not going to be planned on his watch, as it was with Clinton. That’s why the JFK plot was foiled, why Fort Dixx was destroyed, why the planes headed for England made it safely – the only problem is, your clan was pissed because it was the cell phone calls that gave them away.

But Bush was heavily criticized when he nominated Harriet Miers to the Supreme Court and when he backed McCain on immigration. I was in that clan and you cannot ever deny that. It’s simply a fact, so the entire basis to your nonsense is destroyed.

Moving along….

“Because the last time I checked, no Americans were killed, he didn’t need to lie to obtain military action, and ironically enough, he was criticized by then governor Bush for not having an exit strategy.”

Of course we had an exit strategy. We exit when its done right, as it was done right by the end of Bush’s second term. Obama was allowed to pull out for the most part because violence was down incredibly thanks to our awesome troops. Once Bush realized it after the surge, he started setting timelines for withdrawal. Not quite sure what you’re talking about. Moreover; liberals WERE enthusiastic about measures – regardless what actually materialized – on the basis of some pretty drummed up numbers on human rights abuses in the Balkans. Yes, they were supportive of military strategy.

Moreover; George Stephanopoulos himself advised Clinton around that time in 1997 to assassinate Saddam as he was deemed a threat long before.

“Do you see why you get called stupid for saying dumb shit like this? When did I ever say those responsible for bombing the barracks were justified and had my sympathy?”

It’s not stupid, it was the truth. I told you that Reagan had attempted peace-keeping missions between Muslims and Christians. You then implied that he was not peaceful after I told you that the “peace” didn’t work…as if to say “well, if we were a little more peaceful, those terrorists wouldn’t have had to kill all those Marines…” You are simply more interested in demonizing Ronald Reagan than you are at holding terrorists accountable. It’s your own words, don’t be angry at me.

“That’s like me saying that you love child molesters because you refuse to denounce Mark Foley. Oh, hey, everyone, Steve loves child molesters! Does that make sense? Didn’t think so.”

I did denounce Mark Foley. We threw him out of our party – we merely pointed out that you liberals kept Gerry Studds around after he had ACTUAL SEXUAL INTERCOURSE with a 17-year old page. Foley was more about watching the liberals select their moral outrage to sex with youngsters than it was for Republicans to defend Foley which I never did, nor has any other Republican that mattered.

“Goddamn, you’re dumb. It’s like talking to a fucking invalid”

The statement you responded to still stands. You are more interested in rewarding enemies to demonize Ronald Reagan. You want hard workers to pay more taxes so you can reward those less deserving because you think they’ve been dealt some unsuspecting hand at life.

“Give me one instance in which Carter rewarded failure. Just one, and we’ll go from there.”

Attempting to befriend the new Iranian government causing our embassies to be invaded while allowing the Shah into our country for cancer treatment (and to have the knife removed from his back) at the Mayo Clinic.

“Steve, you used to be smarter than this”

Yet, you still find time to respond.

“Wow, apparently you have yet to hit bottom. So, now your beef is with old people collecting Social Security? The same Social Security they spent their whole lives paying into? Hey, we needed something to get us out of the republican great depression…”

Actually most of them could have taken that 7.65% over their lives and invested it themselves and had a much more fruitful return. Of course we have to take care of our seniors, don’t put words in my mouth.

Robert, you used to be more clever than that.

“Who said anything about a debate? The guy came on to talk about his experience, and he was able to be a man and admit he was wrong. It’s kind of sad when you need to take a life lesson from someone who calls himself “mancow””

You used Erich Mullen as an example of diversity on Keith Olbermann. I’m saying that was a horrid morsel even for you to come up with. Mancow is fine. I have no problem with him, but you know damn well that Rush, Ann, Sean, etc. have gone up against much more diversity than Keith Olbermann or Rachel Maddow even came close to.

“So, the guy is stupid and weak because he can’t withstand torture? I’d bet dollars to doughnuts that you couldn’t last five seconds of “water dripping down your nose”.”

I did not say that, “weak” meaning unable to stand for the core values of the party. And ONCE AGAIN, I don’t care to have water dripped down my nose, I didn’t kill anybody! Learn to separate.

Although I did just come out of my pool, so I can relate somewhat.

“Apparently, there also “isn’t” any competent educators anymore either…”

A quick slip I admit, but let’s not forget what most Universities; much like the one I graduated from, are dominated with. Yes, we need more conservative educators, so you got me there!

“Or, and let’s entertain this scenario, they won’t come on his program. I can’t tell you how many people challenge cons to a debate, and they never take them up on that. Ed Shultz just challenged Rush Limbaugh to a debate, do you think he’ll show up?”

Why would any of them go to the programs with the least viewers/listeners? Again Robert, all three have debated main stream liberals over the years, Keith has not.

“No one forced him to offer. He didn’t have to open up his big yapper. He said he’d do it for charity, don’t get pissy with me for pointing it out.”

I’m not. I’m simply saying that I am surprised someone did not come out sooner to say that anyone who expected him to would be crazy. The better question is why he would feel compelled to prove it.

It’s something that should happen to a criminal, not to an innocent American.

“The point is, the police, fire fighters, et. al. are all legitimate needs that are addressed in each community. Something like a full scale war is not something addressed with a few dozen people.”

A war, like a fire, needs its players. This is why we have a military full of America’s best. Not only do you destroy any intellectual honesty of the liberals when you revert back to the “support something so join something” mentality you always quickly go back to, you insult the members of the military by insinuating that what they do is easy enough for anyone to do. So stop using it as an argument. It’s stupid and it insults the people responsible for keeping you safe.

“Wait, you aren’t one of the crazies who thinks Obama was born in Kenya? And the so called liberal media spent months on subjects like insane Rev. Wright and Bill Ayers.”

Funnily enough, you first stated about Obama being born in Kenya before moving onto the real concerns like Wright and Ayers. The Kenya and Muslim stuff was repeated over and over again so that the media could destroy it in an attempt to deflect from Ayers, from Wright, from Rezko, etc. The real concerns were brushed aside so they can work hard to properly inform us of the President’s religious backgrounds.

We knew what church he went to. Wright wasn’t a Muslim, he was just crazy and it coincidentally took Obama years to remove himself from his church, in the same year he ran for President. All one big massive coincidence, I am sure.

“Are you honestly trying to tell me that what you really meant to say was the candy is all dumped into a pile, then the government comes in and distributes it to all the kids? Or were you really trying to tell me that the candy was produced by the government and then passed out to all the kids?”

Why would any government or institution produce something, give it, and then take it away and divide it up?

We were talking about candy, which made me think of a cartoon being passed around where kids were trick-or-treating at Halloween collecting candy and one man says to the kids “now, we have to dump it in a big pile and pass it out evenly to all the kids in the neighborhood” to which the kid with the biggest bag says “oh crap, a Democrat!”

You mentioned the lady passing out candy, it was a metaphor used to describe socialism and yes, the government DOES NOT own or produce the candy, the kids get the candy themselves and it’s then all put together and divided up, much like you want to do to the salaries of CEO’s.

YOU said I described communism by using that metaphor to which we began this back and forth on the definiton of communism which I never originally used to begin with.

Afterwards, you started stating how I didn’t understand the definiton of communism which is untrue.

So, to clarify things, let me state one more time, using the candy metaphor: I do not think Obama is a communist, I think he’s a socialist.

Wrong on all counts. Yeah, people knew they were only getting teaser rates, which were purposefully and deceptively low, they knew that they really qualified for prime loans but that the banks gave them sub prime loans. They knew it all, and decided it was in the best interest of themselves and their families to settle into a house they knew they’d be abandoning in two years. Are you fucking retarded? And seeing as how your party was in charge when this all went down, I would say the blame lies squarely with them. Hey, the ownership society – what a country!

“I guarantee you, those foreclosed on described above that often swim in waters that are above-their-head did not vote for the Republican ticket – nor do I want them to”

Really, because if they truly are the accountability ducking leeches you claim they are, then I’d be shocked to find out they weren’t big dubya supporters…

“Collateral damage is expected in war. That’s your lesson of “cause and effect” when history pretty much already told us what to expect once the shooting started”

History also tells us that with the exception of the Vietnam War, war is a legitimate and unavoidable thing. It’s showed that it requires sacrifice and it also showed that taxes are never cut in a time of war. All that went out the window when junior came to town. Funny how history gets ignored like that.

“and miraculously they tend to cherry-pick the lessons of cause-and-effect when trying to call George Bush a criminal and defending the idiotic spenders of this country who think the rest of us who work hard have to pay for their stupidity.”

You really should avoid using the phrase “cherry pick” and George Bush in the same sentence. And I see you have no problem footing future generations with the bill for his little “democratic” endeavor to the tune of almost two trillion dollars. Who do you think gets to pay for that, genius? I would submit to you that that is completely idiotic spending on the part of the so called fiscally conservative party.

“No, the fact that I criticized Bush on the bailout, Harriet Miers, his stance on immigration, etc…long before you stupidly boasted that I defended everything he did.”

Before the bailout, he was God to you, Reagan incarnate. You like to pretend that isn’t the case because you’ve finally opened your eyes to the mess he left us with, and have no choice but to lay some criticism on him. But hey, you can still cling to the notion that Iraq posed some kind of threat to us, and that he kept the country safe after first letting 3,000 people die.

“It discusses the climbing and quick present death toll in Afghanistan.”

Oh, the British! Now you care about other countries? How does that work? From 2003 on, I guarantee your stance was something along the lines of “fuck the UN, we don’t need to worry about other countries, we only care about us, blah blah”. It’s truly astonishing how quickly your “principles” give way when your party is out of power…

“A simple response once one is over-whelmed. Oh well, we forgive you.”

Yeah, you try not to be overwhelmed when some blowhard ignores everything you’ve ever said and asks moronic questions like this:

“But if you really are taking the position that we indeed have more enemies in Iraq, then you can finally shut up about “what were we doing there?”

“That was going to be my prediction. Of course, the next step is to make excuses for extremist insurgents and terrorists who believe in an ideology you couldn’t last one day under.”

How is that even remotely the point? Why on earth do you give a fuck how someone half a world away lives their life? And how is that a justification for what was done? You cannot defend what common sense so easily tears down, so your choice becomes to call people terrorists because they live in the middle east. You’ve failed every time to answer the simple fucking question of what you would do if some foreign force decided we were a threat and that they should come in, guns blazing, trying to occupy us. If you’re human, your answer would be to drive out the occupiers at any cost, but your nonsensical ideology will force you to say something ridiculous like “I wouldn’t have been a terrorist in the first place”. Too late for that, I suppose…

“Nah there was never a problem, not one until one American President said “No More!” and of course, the destruction of tyranny which was celebrated in the Balkans in denounced by the “progressives.” Familiar road, next time try a different turn.”

Is this a reference to Clinton? Because the last time I checked, no Americans were killed, he didn’t need to lie to obtain military action, and ironically enough, he was criticized by then governor Bush for not having an exit strategy. Still took less than six years though…

“do you see Robert’s inclination to again reward the terrorists for blowing up over 250+ Marines in Lebanon by giving THEM his benefit of the doubt over Ronald Reagan for the sheer purposes of sounding like Dennis Kucinich?”

Do you see why you get called stupid for saying dumb shit like this? When did I ever say those responsible for bombing the barracks were justified and had my sympathy? You like to assign opinions to others because you don’t know how to have an open debate (and yes I appreciate the irony of that statement after having called attention to your predilection for stupidity). You say sensationalistic things to make liberals seem crazy, yet anyone who has read this exchange will see that I never professed this position to which you’ve assigned me. That’s like me saying that you love child molesters because you refuse to denounce Mark Foley. Oh, hey, everyone, Steve loves child molesters! Does that make sense? Didn’t think so.

“You’re the one who progresses at digging a pile of mud for yourself and you merely just pointed out as fact what Republicans have said all along. Whether it be national security, taxation, financial crises – your position stands to punish friends and reqard [sic] enemies. Punish success and reward failure”

Goddamn, you’re dumb. It’s like talking to a fucking invalid…

“the successful are only successful because they are evil in some unprovable but totally politcally [sic] correct way you dream up in your mind and the failures were victimized. The terrorists are misunderstood and Reagan along with the Marines under his command were the peacebreakers.”

Steve, you used to be smarter than this…

“Carter’s reward for failure took the rates and made them meaningless.”

Give me one instance in which Carter rewarded failure. Just one, and we’ll go from there.

“Americans like yourself got used to others paying for others to live and breathe, as if the world owned them something for being here”

Wow, apparently you have yet to hit bottom. So, now your beef is with old people collecting Social Security? The same Social Security they spent their whole lives paying into? Hey, we needed something to get us out of the republican great depression…

“The crackheads at ACORN are still crackheads and Obama is eating steak.”

Yes, and the scumbags at the Heritage Foundation are still scumbags, and you’re still eating crow. What’s the point?

“The point is, that was no debate for Keith Olbermann and a sad excuse. “

Who said anything about a debate? The guy came on to talk about his experience, and he was able to be a man and admit he was wrong. It’s kind of sad when you need to take a life lesson from someone who calls himself “mancow”

“The only reason you guys use Republicans for credibility is when some stupid weak-one comes out to grab headlines”

So, the guy is stupid and weak because he can’t withstand torture? I’d bet dollars to doughnuts that you couldn’t last five seconds of “water dripping down your nose”.

“We never said there were never any bad Republicans, but there isn’t any good Democrats.”

Apparently, there also “isn’t” any competent educators anymore either…

“Instead of making Ann Coulter “The Worst Person in the World” for the trillionth time, how about Keith actually DEBATE her? I guarantee you, it’ll never happen, nor would he debate Bill O’Reilly or Sean Hannity because he couldn’t do it.”

Or, and let’s entertain this scenario, they won’t come on his program. I can’t tell you how many people challenge cons to a debate, and they never take them up on that. Ed Shultz just challenged Rush Limbaugh to a debate, do you think he’ll show up?

“I’m not sure about that, however, he never owed to you to be waterboarded.”

No one forced him to offer. He didn’t have to open up his big yapper. He said he’d do it for charity, don’t get pissy with me for pointing it out.

“Another example, YES it is absurd to demand someone join something to support something. Unless this year you are willing to fight crime, fight fires, teach a class full of screaming fifth graders (though I must admit the union benefits I hear are excellent), or plan on growing breasts….don’t ever again pretend that you support the police, fire fighters, teachers, or women. If you support gays, do you have to sleep with men?”

Wow, really? There’s a far cry from the subject at hand. You sound like that idiot that said he supported the Yankees, but that didn’t mean he needed to join the team. The point is, the police, fire fighters, et. al. are all legitimate needs that are addressed in each community. Something like a full scale war is not something addressed with a few dozen people. The difference is, everyone appreciates the need for police and firefighters, those people aren’t sent in to fight crime that doesn’t exist. They aren’t sent to douse water on homes that aren’t on fire. You believed what society as a whole did not, and that was that Iraq posed an immediate threat against this country. You thought it was fine that so many people were dying needlessly, because you felt it was justified. That being the case, it only makes sense to be hands on with something you in the minority believe so strongly in. Like if you were totally stoked with the idea of sifting through pig shit to find rare coins in some remote part of the world, one would assume that you’d be the first to volunteer for that, right? Same thing here.

“Mirculously, [sic] the news stories on that ONE video were plenty. The media used all the crazy stories like Obama’s birth certificate and his alleged Muslim background to refrain from talking about real concerns like Ayers and Wright”

Wait, you aren’t one of the crazies who thinks Obama was born in Kenya? And the so called liberal media spent months on subjects like insane Rev. Wright and Bill Ayers. The people obviously didn’t buy what the media was selling. The only people who were concerned with that were dopey idiots too willing to let the REAL real issues, which were the war and the economy, go undiscussed. Wright and Ayers were the distractions, not some crazy old bat who thought Obama was a terrorist.

“Nice try. I never said the candy was publicly owned. I said it was privately owned and it was passed out at the will of the people. I then said that the government came in and split it up to divide up. What you just described (the bad definition of “communism”) does not even come close to defining my original comment on socialism to which you said sounded like communism in your sad attempt at being clever.
Once again, it backfired on you….two steps back for the progressive.”

Oh, my God. You have a terrible time handling being wrong, don’t you? Why don’t you tell me where the government fits into this commentary:

“You’re one of those that believes all the kids should dump their sacks into one pile so it could be divided equally.”

Are you honestly trying to tell me that what you really meant to say was the candy is all dumped into a pile, then the government comes in and distributes it to all the kids? Or were you really trying to tell me that the candy was produced by the government and then passed out to all the kids? Either way, you’re wrong. That’s cute though, how you try to feign some sort of triumph in a conversation about candy because you can’t properly assign words with their appropriate definitions…

Unlike past wars, this war has media coverage that can speed information to the masses through various forums in almost real time.

My great uncle was in WW II. He moved across occupied France and Germany as part of the D-Day invasion. He was not part of the Omaha or Utah beach landings. His action came after that.

People don’t know what his unit did to captured German soldiers. Poeple shouldn’t know. But, when an enemy unit tries to kill your men and you capture them, do you think being Mr. Nice Nice to a bunch of guys who just killed some of your guys is a top priority?

There are things we know about Iraq that we should not know. Unless you are there and under fire, you don’t need to know such things.
Nobody does.

Maybe this summer you can visit Stockton, CA and see for yourself. Entire neighborhoods are nearly devoid of occupied homes.

You can also swing by Vallejo, CA before you visit San Francisco and see more of the same.

Stockton and Vallejo had two things in common. For people who could afford to live in the immediate Bay Area, Vallejo was the last place they could afford and still be in the Bay Area. Stockton was the nex place out in the Valley that was affordable and reasonably close to the job rich Bay Area.

Both towns are in bad straights. Stockton is one of the worse hit areas in the U.S.

My city has very few foreclosures because even at no money down it was not affordable to live here. No amount of creative financing can get you into a home in this stuck up suburb.

Really, because nice neighborhoods in the area here beg to differ. Before “working to earn it” went out of style, these neighborhoods were envied by all. Now, every three houses have tall grass empty insides, and most have had water left running and concrete poured down pipes to ruin the plumbing. Yes, Robert – those people re-financed EVERY YEAR that the house’s value would go up to pay for their over-their-head spending accrued the year before. To defend this and pretend as if it doesn’t exist is preposterous of you, it is a massive problem and SOLELY to blame for the largest cluster of foreclosures last year. There is one party to blame for that and it’s not mine.

I guarantee you, those foreclosed on described above that often swim in waters that are above-their-head did not vote for the Republican ticket – nor do I want them to. They wanted Obama to pay their bills.

“I’m not sure how the conversation went from you defending the crimes of the last administration to you defending the credit card companies”

Cause and effect was your topic. Collateral damage is expected in war. That’s your lesson of “cause and effect” when history pretty much already told us what to expect once the shooting started. Suddenly, liberals acted as if they had never cracked a history book….and miraculously they tend to cherry-pick the lessons of cause-and-effect when trying to call George Bush a criminal and defending the idiotic spenders of this country who think the rest of us who work hard have to pay for their stupidity.

“What exactly was I proven wrong about? The fact that you pushed all your sycophantic instincts aside to give one piss poor criticism of Bush?”

No, the fact that I criticized Bush on the bailout, Harriet Miers, his stance on immigration, etc…long before you stupidly boasted that I defended everything he did.

“Short amount of time in Afghanistan? You know we’ve been there since 2001, right?”

I’m talking about this:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,531548,00.html

It discusses the climbing and quick present death toll in Afghanistan. Apparently, Obama has no exit strategy, no timeline, no plans? Perhaps you can tell us precisely what that is.

“You’re an idiot.”

A simple response once one is over-whelmed. Oh well, we forgive you.

“And it infuriated people like you when they defended their country, making the solution to kill more of them, as if that solved anything.”

That was going to be my prediction. Of course, the next step is to make excuses for extremist insurgents and terrorists who believe in an ideology you couldn’t last one day under.

Nah there was never a problem, not one until one American President said “No More!” and of course, the destruction of tyranny which was celebrated in the Balkans in denounced by the “progressives.” Familiar road, next time try a different turn.

“Maybe that’s because his peace keeping missions consisted of dropping bombs on Lebanon. Just a thought…”

Another lie. Reagan’s peace-keeping force did not consist of dropping bombs on villages and while he didn’t invite them over for tea as the liberals would love to do with extremists like them or Bill Ayers for that matter, he was able to localize many of the efforts. It wasn’t until after the 1983 attacks on the Marine barracks in Beirut until we shot back with full force. That attack was in response to the effort. Stop trying to misplace America’s response to the attack after October of 1983. Prior to that, Reagan did plenty to establish peace, the darlings merely weren’t interested.

But this is another fact that liberals hate having pointed out – do you see Robert’s inclination to again reward the terrorists for blowing up over 250+ Marines in Lebanon by giving THEM his benefit of the doubt over Ronald Reagan for the sheer purposes of sounding like Dennis Kucinich?

You’re the one who progresses at digging a pile of mud for yourself and you merely just pointed out as fact what Republicans have said all along. Whether it be national security, taxation, financial crises – your position stands to punish friends and reqard enemies. Punish success and reward failure…the successful are only successful because they are evil in some unprovable but totally politcally correct way you dream up in your mind and the failures were victimized. The terrorists are misunderstood and Reagan along with the Marines under his command were the peacebreakers.

We get it! Just don’t get mad at us for pointing it out whenever you bring it up.

“Right, and it only took three presidents to kick in? That’s moronic.”

Carter’s reward for failure took the rates and made them meaningless. After FDR’s massive increase which was supposed to be temporary – Americans like yourself got used to others paying for others to live and breathe, as if the world owned them something for being here. It was high time to show that tax rates will NEVER erase the unworthy’s constant actions that put themselves in these places to begin with. Even now, the weak are continuing to grow weaker. The crackheads at ACORN are still crackheads and Obama is eating steak. There’s a price, and your crowd will be the ones to pay it because of the support you throw our for the idiocy, not because people like me are greedy.

“What is this obsession you have with turning everything into a popularity contest? You were a lonely kid, weren’t you? The point is, this dumbass held the same belief that you refuse to let go of, that waterboarding is not torture.”

The fact is, liberals “opposition” usually consists of people like Scott McClellan or this “dumbass” (agreed). It amazes me that CBS and MSNBC are now reporting what Levi Johnston thinks of Sarah Palin as a President.

The average news anchor at either network I am assuming is college educated. What’s the bigger mystery here?

1.) What does Levi Johnston; a high school dropout and deadbeat dad think of Sarah Palin as President and what’s the fastest way to get this important news to the public?

2.) Why would anyone worth their salt ask Levi Johnston what he thinks of the Backstreet Boys, let alone who would make a good President?

Somehow, Keith Olbermann and Rachel Maddow thought it was newsworthty. I cannot say I am surprised.

Stephen Colbert also thought it was newsworthy to interview Kathleen Parker – (THE Kathleen Parker!). The one who wrote a column (alleged Republican) during the campaign saying Sarah Palin was a bad choice for Vice President.

It’s why “The View” decided to have Meghan McCain on. It’s exactly why Meghan McCain now thinks she can publish a film next year about the life of a “Republican” as a young girl as if anyone is remotely interested. (Curiously enough requesting that Hillary Duff play her).

Say, couldn’t Meghan and Levi collobarate on a book telling us what’s wrong with Republicanism? I can see the CBS two-hour special now!

The point is, that was no debate for Keith Olbermann and a sad excuse. The only reason you guys use Republicans for credibility is when some stupid weak-one comes out to grab headlines. We never said there were never any bad Republicans, but there isn’t any good Democrats.

Sean Hannity has taken on James Carville, Bob Beckel, Al Sharpton, every head of every liberal organization, members of the Nation magazine, Cindy Sheehan, Bill Maher, Michael Moore.

Instead of making Ann Coulter “The Worst Person in the World” for the trillionth time, how about Keith actually DEBATE her? I guarantee you, it’ll never happen, nor would he debate Bill O’Reilly or Sean Hannity because he couldn’t do it.

“I don’t recall demanding that you be waterboarded.”

Mentioning that any Republican be water-boarded – even if it were Rush, Coulter, or Hannity is absurd. You know what I meant. Stop trying to divert.

“What’s even more absurd is that Hannitary napkin offered to be waterboarded, you know for the families of troops. Then, mysteriously, he doesn’t utter a peep about it in the future at all, even when money was involved.”

I’m not sure about that, however, he never owed to you to be waterboarded. The idea that he had to was created once against by liberal stupidity.

“I don’t support abortion, dummy.”

Affectionately, I am glad nimrod.

“particularly the chickenhawks like yourself who were gung ho for a war you wholeheartedly supported, yet refused to fight it yourself.”

Another example, YES it is absurd to demand someone join something to support something. Unless this year you are willing to fight crime, fight fires, teach a class full of screaming fifth graders (though I must admit the union benefits I hear are excellent), or plan on growing breasts….don’t ever again pretend that you support the police, fire fighters, teachers, or women. If you support gays, do you have to sleep with men?

How stupid. The point Robert, is that those types of STUPID arguments should never be to begin with!

“So, this lady is a democrat?”

Mirculously, the news stories on that ONE video were plenty. The media used all the crazy stories like Obama’s birth certificate and his alleged Muslim background to refrain from talking about real concerns like Ayers and Wright. But I do not recall many answers to Palin’s “book banning” rumors, or the rumors about Trig not belonging to her. The point is, liberals used the crazy rumors of Obama to cover that true things we could back up with no problem whatsoever.

“You still don’t know what communism, do you? It is a society where all property is PUBLICLY owned. Communism is not a form of government in the way that you’re thinking. Communism was implemented by native Americans where anything and everything was collectively owned by the tribe. So, my original point still stands, you made an idiotic and factually incorrect comparison.”

Nice try. I never said the candy was publicly owned. I said it was privately owned and it was passed out at the will of the people. I then said that the government came in and split it up to divide up. What you just described (the bad definition of “communism”) does not even come close to defining my original comment on socialism to which you said sounded like communism in your sad attempt at being clever.

Once again, it backfired on you….two steps back for the progressive.

Get used to those terms: “back” and “fired.”

The number of people who actually bought homes they knew they couldn’t afford is slim, so slim that you even mentioning it makes you look foolish. You know who those people are that did that? Not the people who lived in them, the people flipping the houses to get rich. Don’t they now automatically have your admiration?

“Yes, those kinds of consequences are great! But, because of your views, most people will never be forced to feel them, leaving millions of unlearned lessons and millions more of those same mistakes to happen all over again.”

I’m not sure how the conversation went from you defending the crimes of the last administration to you defending the credit card companies, but some of us decent folk believe in a little thing called usury laws. You’re fine with people being ripped off because it makes for richer clients, or some other equally disgusting reason.

“Thanks! Of course, you’d minimize it once you were proven wrong. I know, you’re a liberal who is above being driven crazy to the point of vulgarities.”

What exactly was I proven wrong about? The fact that you pushed all your sycophantic instincts aside to give one piss poor criticism of Bush? That’s not proving me wrong, I’ve known your weak position for some time now. And apparently anyone who uses “vulgarities” is crazy. Better to be crazy than a sissy who’s offended by (fairly) nondescript words, I say…

“The numbers are in the time span of the entire Iraq was versus the deaths in the short amount of time in Afghanistan right now. They are much worse than in Iraq.”

Short amount of time in Afghanistan? You know we’ve been there since 2001, right?

“But if you really are taking the position that we indeed have more enemies in Iraq, then you can finally shut up about “what were we doing there? ””

You’re an idiot.

“A batch of lies but miraculously, Robert can detect over 4,000 military deaths in a country killed by people who had no problem with us – ever!”

I never said they had no problem with us, I said we had no problem with them. We created a problem for them when we started bombing their country for reasons only believed by ignorant people in this country. And it infuriated people like you when they defended their country, making the solution to kill more of them, as if that solved anything. What did you think, Steve, that they were just going to allow themselves to be slaughtered because America is great? Don’t be so dense.

“Nope, I think collateral damage is just a part of war.”

Compassionate conservatism, ladies and gentlemen. This is why people hate anyone idiotic enough to admit to being a republican.

“The point is, the media has stopped caring suddenly.”

Suddenly? The media stopped caring about Afghanistan a loooooong time ago, friend.

“This is like taking credit for putting a piece of paper in the trash”

Are you really this partisan? You do know that Israelis and Egyptians (and Americans as well) both said “no Carter, no peace treaty”, right? So much for that paper in the trash thing.

“Reagan worked feverishly to establish peace-keeping missions with Lebanon between Muslims and Christians. It didn’t work.”

Maybe that’s because his peace keeping missions consisted of dropping bombs on Lebanon. Just a thought…

“Nonsense, with the famed Johnson rates came Carterism’s famed unemployment, national record interest, and double-digit inflation.”

Right, and it only took three presidents to kick in? That’s moronic.

“drive the stock market through the roof “

Apparently they skipped the “Black Monday” fiasco in neocon class…

“You think the idea for those shows stemmed from Jimmy Carter?”

The fact that you can credit a president with the creation of a television show says all sorts of weird shit about you…

“I always love this argument. When dealing with terrorists, I’d prefer not use the same standard of what we could get out of the great Erich Muller, no matter how influential and respected throughout the world as he may be.”

What is this obsession you have with turning everything into a popularity contest? You were a lonely kid, weren’t you? The point is, this dumbass held the same belief that you refuse to let go of, that waterboarding is not torture. He experienced it first hand, and he came to the same conclusion that any logical (i.e., not you) person would come to, and that is, it is absolutely torture. You can’t wrap your brain around the truth, so you attack the guy’s popularity, as if that had any fucking effect on the outcome. What, will it take Ann Coulter being waterboarded and declaring it torture until you believe it?

“liberals demand we be water-boarded because we support it”

I don’t recall demanding that you be waterboarded.

“Robert, will you abort yourself since you support abortion?”

I don’t support abortion, dummy.

“liberals want news-anchors to want to be able to withstand what happens to someone who flies a plane into a building”

I didn’t realize that people suspected of terrorists were born with some innate ability to survive drowning. It probably comes in handy when you’re surrounded by sand on all sides.

“Sean Hannity or any conservative does not have to be waterboarded to support it, that’s absurd”

What’s even more absurd is that Hannitary napkin offered to be waterboarded, you know for the families of troops. Then, mysteriously, he doesn’t utter a peep about it in the future at all, even when money was involved.

And it’s not absurd that you experience something to support it. It makes for a beautiful example of the cowardice of conservatives, particularly the chickenhawks like yourself who were gung ho for a war you wholeheartedly supported, yet refused to fight it yourself. It shouldn’t surprise anyone that cons aren’t willing to experience that pesky little water dripping down their noses…

“since Sarah Palin’s making you lose your hair everytime I mention her?”

You seem incredibly preoccupied with the idea of me getting upset with Sarah Palin for reasons you have yet to offer. Does it bother you that I don’t think much of her and don’t bother to waste my time talking about her? It seems like you keep looking for a specific reaction, and you’re disappointed because you’re not getting it. Kind of like when you ignore a crying baby, and it makes them cry even more because you aren’t paying attention to them…

“It wasn’t conservatives calling him a Muslim.”

So, this lady is a democrat?:

Yeah, I saw that Hillary shirt she was wearing…

“No….the government doesn’t own the candy, little liberal. If it did, it would be communist. The people still own it and they are the ones who pass it out….the government just cannot keep its hands off those collected.”

You still don’t know what communism, do you? It is a society where all property is PUBLICLY owned. Communism is not a form of government in the way that you’re thinking. Communism was implemented by native Americans where anything and everything was collectively owned by the tribe. So, my original point still stands, you made an idiotic and factually incorrect comparison.

Sure, like – you have to go to work, save your money and don’t buy a house you cannot afford! Oh yeah, and don’t run up credit cards that you don’t intend on paying back without governmental intrusive legislating re-writing the agreements you made when you were sliding the plastic through having one hell of a shopping spree. Yes, those kinds of consequences are great! But, because of your views, most people will never be forced to feel them, leaving millions of unlearned lessons and millions more of those same mistakes to happen all over again.

“Oh, brav-the-fuck-o! Good call man, you’re finally able to acknowledge reality in some small sense. Is that an earnest attempt at making me think you have an objective bone in your body? If it is, it ain’t working.”

Thanks! Of course, you’d minimize it once you were proven wrong. I know, you’re a liberal who is above being driven crazy to the point of vulgarities.

“How am I even supposed to make sense of that? Stop talking gibberish or just stop talking is the best advice I could give here.”

The statement was quite clear. Try reading it again.

“Simple math tells us that the 4,323 who died in the Iraq debacle is far higher than 740. Ann Coulter is a moron, and I don’t even know what that makes you for believing her.”

The numbers are in the time span of the entire Iraq was versus the deaths in the short amount of time in Afghanistan right now. They are much worse than in Iraq.

But if you really are taking the position that we indeed have more enemies in Iraq, then you can finally shut up about “what were we doing there? ”

“Possibly. Although in fairness to objectivity, it was probably to remind those of us with a conscience just how many died needlessly over a batch of lies.”

A batch of lies but miraculously, Robert can detect over 4,000 military deaths in a country killed by people who had no problem with us – ever!

“Would these be the same generals who agreed with him about not torturing people anymore and closing the prison camp in Cuba? And all of a sudden you care about collateral damage?”

Nope, I think collateral damage is just a part of war. The point is, the media has stopped caring suddenly.

“Tell me though, was is screwed up that he negotiated peace between Israel and Egypt?”

This is like taking credit for putting a piece of paper in the trash. Reagan worked feverishly to establish peace-keeping missions with Lebanon between Muslims and Christians. It didn’t work.

This proves the broader point that it never was about one country versus another one. It is one extreme ideology versus freedom. And that ideology (the one that was in Iran at the time) got 150+ Americans held hostage for 444 days which started the splendid relationship we have with Iran today.

“If you don’t know the answer to that question by now, you’re an idiot. If he had left them where Johnson had them, we wouldn’t have experienced two recessions under Reagan (boom, bubble, burst).”

Nonsense, with the famed Johnson rates came Carterism’s famed unemployment, national record interest, and double-digit inflation. Reagan inherited it and was given eight years to do what he did – re-establish Americanism, lower taxes by the end of his second term, drive the stock market through the roof and create opportunity all across the land. There was only one problem, Robert….you had to work for it.

Where do you think shows like “Dallas” and “Dynasty” thrived from? It was the massive excess that the Reaganesque era of the 1980′s represented. Only on TV, it was cool for Blake Carrington or J.R. to make a shrewd business decision because it made for good business.

You think the idea for those shows stemmed from Jimmy Carter?

“So, lower ratings means dumber host? I think Hannity proves the fallacy of that notion. And, in fairness, Olbermann did have a guest with an opposing viewpoint on his show. On May 29, 2009, Erich Muller appeared on Countdown to discuss his newfound appreciation for the definition of the word torture.”

LMAO, “THE” Erich Muller!? The great and world known Erich Muller?

Give me a break!

“This conservative radio talk show host was much like you, a full on believer that waterboarding is nothing more than dripping water down someone’s nose”

I always love this argument. When dealing with terrorists, I’d prefer not use the same standard of what we could get out of the great Erich Muller, no matter how influential and respected throughout the world as he may be.

It’s hilarious to me that a.) liberals demand we be water-boarded because we support it. Robert, will you abort yourself since you support abortion? Can we abort the terrorists instead of water-boarding them? b.) liberals want news-anchors to want to be able to withstand what happens to someone who flies a plane into a building. How about one liberal live as a Muslim for a year and be forced to follow such rules, then come back and tell us just how dangerous Christianity is. Sean Hannity or any conservative does not have to be waterboarded to support it, that’s absurd. Just how long are you going to use that childish argument?

“You clearly have no idea what TS actually is. If you did, you’d know that coprolalia is rarely associated with the disease. But, prove to me that I’ve ever been an emotional wreck over some nitwit like Sarah Palin, and I’ll eat my fucking hat.”

Yes I know what a Tourette’s fit looks like and two: shouldn’t we check with a news anchor on MSNBC to make sure eating a hat isn’t considered “torture?” I cannot possibly support doing it simply because Sarah Palin gets your blood pressure up. Curiously though, why would you even need a hat….since Sarah Palin’s making you lose your hair everytime I mention her?

“So, using your “logic”, that would mean well over half of the country’s comedians have a predilection for murder. That’s fucking idiotic and you know it.”

You’re not a comedian. Bill Maher usually makes a good point first.

“That means you did a terrible job at convincing the public that he was an ultra liberal socialist Muslim.”

It wasn’t conservatives calling him a Muslim. It was Democrats using it to detour from real relations like Wright and Ayers. And because the media contributed to the misinformation to Americans about his socialist views, here we are today and here is approval numbers are slipping. Any idea why that is?

“And as of April this year, 95% of them are.”

$13 for trillions in debt left for their future generations to pay for? Ask them to check that box again, why don’t you?

“Trust me when I tell you that that’s not the reason that people thought she was crazy. She’s widely considered an inveterate liar and rightly so.”

She’s never lied. Even when she pointed out the Keith Olbermann went to the Old Macdonald Cornell.

“That’s communism, idiot, not socialism. If you’re going to erroneously label me something, make sure you know what the hell you’re talking about first.”

No….the government doesn’t own the candy, little liberal. If it did, it would be communist. The people still own it and they are the ones who pass it out….the government just cannot keep its hands off those collected.