How is the example that Tom (and I) gave drummed up? If any democrat were in office in 2001, and took as much vacation as the vapid moron that was actually in office at the time, and ignored as many warnings as he did, every republican and conservative would have been screaming impeachment from the rooftops within six months. I guarantee it.

How can one argue that this is not a civil liberty violation of theirs?”

Everyone is arguing that, especially liberals. I’m a bit surprised that you’re taking a stance of being against it (if that is in fact what you’re doing)…

That is not at all what I took away from your screed. I saw finger pointing and blaming, as I saw in the rest of the corporate media. If you say you aren’t doing any of those things now, I’ll have no choice but to accept that.

“How many times do I have to remind you? There was plenty of indignation on our part when Bush did things we didn’t like. ”

I applaud you for bringing up the port security debacle; most cons would like to leave that in the past. It just seems to me that (and I can’t single you out because this blog wasn’t around at the time) conservatives, by and large, are ridiculously hypocritical in this (and all, to be fair) area. Like, cartoonishly so. It’s almost as if the bank of people having short memories. Just take Rudy Guiliani’s gum flapping this morning. We weren’t attacked on Bush’s watch, but we were on Obama’s? That’s pretty astonishing, considering the polar opposite is what happened. And it’s the same people who were giving Bush a pass for what they now view as completely egregious.

“It’s not just their appearance, Robert, but primarily, YES.”

Well, I don’t know what a Muslim looks like, do you? Take this Nigerian kid, he looked just like any kid in any mall in America. Or how about the shoe bomber, Richard Reid? He was British and Jamaican, not sporting a turban and a two foot beard. I fully believe that profiling behavior is the way to go, because sooner or later, they’re going to start sneaking people on planes that look nothing like Osama Bin Laden.

“I have no problem with racial profiling if a certain group has espoused marked hatred and loathing for us to the point that they want to slaughter every single one of us.”

Yes, but you can’t RACIALLY profile someone based on their RELIGIOUS beliefs, which you would have no way of knowing anyway. Like I said, the last two examples of people attempting to blow planes out of the sky haven’t exactly fit the model of what you think we should be looking for.

Bush had to be in office for eight years for you to craft that drummed up measurement.

Obama took one at Martha’s Vineyard and ignored Cindy Sheehan when she protested him. (Somehow the media ignored her to in the case of this president).

Then he took one in Hawaii just before the close of the year.

Two major terrorist attacks on our soil in one year.

The difference between Obama and Bush is stellar with the Sheehan comparison. You were too busy counting (as the media was) during Bush’s administration to realize the successes. Now, people like Mel and I have to make up for that.

The easiest and silliest thing in this forum was finally getting you to use the word “Christmas” in defense of a liberal President.

Congrats. Your intelligence is always welcome around here.

Sometimes you just gotta wonder if someone’s joking….

Let me remind you that Bush was the most vacationed president in history and sat reading a children’s book during the biggest terrorist attack ever on the country of which his job was to protect. Also, that the warning he got of 911 wasn’t enough to get him out of his Texas Ranch, a case in which he actually could have done something, unlike Obama who had no need to go back to work, having received nothing more than the information that a terrrorist botched an attack, at which point there was no need for action. Oh! And Obama actually had a REASON to be on vacation. You see, Dems understant that there are certain TIMES meant for vacation, such as Winter break. Bush went on vacation whenever he so much as got chapped lips. And yet despite him being the most vacationed president ever, even when he receives intel on what will be the worst terrorist attack ever, u neocons manage to summon the balls to attack Obama for going on one date night and one vacation on freakin’ Christmas, which for some reason you guys must no longer support the sanctity of I guess…

Quit making this so easy Mel. You’re almost as silly as Steve!

I know people who were born in the Mideast and have become naturalized American citizens after fleeing their home countries because their Christian faith–or, in a few cases, refusal to ascribe to any faith in any god–made them targets for violence within their own families. I went to school with a girl from Iran whose family fled that country and asked for political asylum because they were facing stiff persecution from the religious police and Sharia courts.

One I know who was born in Egypt and converted to Christianity from Islam agrees with me that all men of Middle Eastern descent should be profiled. Coming from him, that’s pretty strong.

All of that makes for great theatrics. Watching those busy TSA people view the scanners and sort through stuff is supposed to make us all feel safe. For most of us it does.

But, the reality is it is one big waste of money. An 89 year old person is not going to blow up an airliner. But we waste money searching these people so we can be nice and fair.

We have a funny trouble in America; when we do something and it doesn’t work, we automatically assume it can never work. Racial profiling was a means for some dishonest law enforcement folks to abuse people. But, that doesn’t mean racial profiling is always a bad thing.

Finally, consider this. A white man approximately 6ft tall and weighing 200 lbs. is witnessed by 10 other people robbing a bank. White men who fit that description are suspects. It would be silly to consider black people or Asian people or women as suspects because none of them match the suspect’s description.

But, at the airports none of that matters. We are all suspects even though few of us match the descrption of actual terrorists. I hope people really feel safe because a lot of time and money is wasted on making people feel that way.

The only way that we can really stop these terrorists is to do a more detailed and thorough search of every one who fits the profile mentioned above. We need to pass a law saying that this will be done and you will not be able to board the plane if you refuse. I understand that it is inconvenient for them and they may feel singled out, but people are dying.

Don’t get me wrong, I know many Muslims and people of Middle Eastern descent. They are wonderful people and they wouldn’t harm a fly. But unfortunately the men who are committing these terrorist attacks have the same type of ethnic profile. As I said, people are dying. This is not the time or place to be politically correct.

If we continue to refuse to engage in ethnic profiling at our airports, that is our decision. But if we choose not to do it, we must accept and understand the fact that from time to time a terrorist will be sucessful and people will die.

I don’t like the idea of having to do these things any more than anyone else, but I dislike the idea of being killed in a terrorist hijacking of a plane even more.

Let’s observe the idea of full body scans where 2M people a day will have their full naked bodies viewed by airport security — nearly a trillion per year.

How can one argue that this is not a civil liberty violation of theirs?